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Author Topic: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1  (Read 1761 times)

Stoker

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2020, 12:43:35 pm »
Our good Forum friend Jan (classix) is perhaps the best expert we have on all things related to Solar Engines of Phoenix Arizona, but sadly he is tied down by his work just now, and has no spare time to chime in and provide his wealth of knowledge. Hopefully soon he will be freed up enough to participate in this thread. He is certainly aware of it, and following it as best he can.

To my knowledge, he has the most complete collection of SEoPA material of anyone I know, and seems to have just about everything they ever produced, and most all of the available ephemera as well. He has aided me on several occasions in obtaining SEoPA items that I was looking to add to my collection, and even stood down for me on items he might well have wanted himself.

The man is that helpful, kind and considerate ...... top quality gent that he is!!!

As to the JEMCO reference, I'm still unsure just how that fits into the picture, but I do know that besides a few hobby tools, they also sold several Wilesco steam engines and accessories, seemingly through the SEoPA ads and addresses, with their fliers often accompanying the literature included in engines as shipped.
"Information is not knowledge, Knowledge is not wisdom, Wisdom is not truth, Truth is not beauty, Beauty is not love, Love is not music: Music is THE BEST...   
Wisdom is the domain of the Wis (which is extinct). Beauty is a French phonetic corruption of a short cloth neck ornament currently in resurgence..."
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Hero

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2020, 02:33:22 pm »
My 8xxx engine is also a "Thermal Energy Engines" model, with the Ross book numbered the same.
Bob

catman

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2020, 07:55:18 pm »
In looking at the 1977 letter from John Griffin, he states never to oil the piston or the dis-placer shaft. I knew never to oil the piston, but had not heard to never oil the dis-placer shaft. The current operating manual from PM Research for the #1 solar engine states that it's ok to oil the shaft. I wonder what has changed, or is oiling the dis-placer shaft wrong?

Mike 

J.Jackson

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2020, 12:21:07 pm »
This little engine is becoming the quintessential definition of a Classic.
The basic design is 65~ years of continuous production and still being made today.

So it starts as a design and product of an angry Welshman, who has them built by Manxmen , which then somehow sends them away to an Indian Tribal Series in Arizona, where a mysterious twin version appears , and which both morph into a JEMCO product, that is latter sent across the USA to Papa Mike in Wellsville NY , and today made alongside hi-tech 21st-century aviation parts.   
Quite a journey.
https://www.papa-mike.com/about-us/

Methinks the “Thermal Energy Engine” may be just an early mold stamp/embossing of the Solar Engine Phoenix Company. Perhaps same company simply using 2+ different simultaneous molds for the same engine. Thermal Energy Engine may have been what the Griffins’ (or Ed Morgan) first thought to name that Phoenix Solar engine, and quickly changed their minds to the hot-topic 1977 buzz word of “Solar Engine” ?  Same company , two molds, same engine. Why waste a good mold ? The reason I think this is I can find no literature or business data for Thermal Energy Engines in Phoenix Az in mid-1970’s. To sell a toy engine in the 1970’s you had to somehow advertise it, then have a mail order address to send it from. 1977 toy Stirling engine sales from the back pages of pulp magazines had to be pretty limited and it is amazing that Solar (or Thermal) could mail-order sell thousands a year. IF someone produces actual sales or tech literature for the Thermal Energy Engine , well that blows away my aforementioned theory.

I did source Ed E. Morgan founding JEMCO in 1973, sixty miles southeast of Phoenix.  No data though on what JEMCO did then in 73’. Maybe JEMCO was derived from Jeanette & Ed Morgan Company. They strongly look like venture capitalist and ‘importers’. To me it seems the John & Clyde Griffin show a passion and technical skill in manufacturing Stirling engines that I can’t yet find referenced in Ed Morgan. I can’t tell if Ed/JEMCO initially owned or founded Solar Engines, but it is clear their majority ownership in the 1980’s scrubbed the Griffins’ from the sales literature and the new 2nd Ed. 1981 Andy Ross book. It appears that JEMCO discontinued that fantastic serial numbering system from the Ross books, the actual engine, and it’s shipping box.
That “Solar Engine”  R-circle trademark info would provide key dates and ownership info.

Hero—- what edition is your numbered Andy Ross book?
Catman —- from what I can see on my 2 engines , I think John Griffin was cautiously advising newbie owners to not oil that shaft because it is so easy to over-oil it and maybe contaminate the piston. 43 years latter I think PMR maybe says it OK to lightly (flea sized drop) oil the “shaft” but not the piston. Just a guess.

Link to recent ebay Thermal Engine sale. That engine is identical to my 1977 Solar engine. Note it has owners manual which likely dated it 1978 or after.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Stirling-Hot-Air-Engine-Thermal-Energy-Engines-Phoenix-w-Instructions-/254618781343?nma=true&si=pS2PyLw80iSYolzJh6SItfLFxtE%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

Post 1981 JEMCO advertising, like Stoker mentioned, found stuffed in my  2nd Ed Andy Ross book —->






.


Hero

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2020, 02:09:35 pm »
My 8xxx engine is also a "Thermal Energy Engines" model, with the Ross book numbered the same.

Jasper, my Ross book reads "Copyright 1977 by Solar Engines."
Bob

J.Jackson

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #20 on: August 08, 2020, 06:31:51 pm »
Hero; here are two pics of the Andy Ross books I have.
 1977 1st Edition is 121 numbered pages . Second Edition 1981 has 122 numbered pages.
 {I’m so far suspecting your #8000 series engine was made around-about latter 1978 early 1979 or so ... just guessulating  ;D )

Back covers —- Top book in pic is 1977 , bottom is JEMCO era 1981 plus

Opening pages —- Left side book in pic is 1977 , right side is JEMCO era 1981 plus



Hero

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2020, 07:21:43 pm »
My book. 121 pages.

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My engine. Came without a burner. But a faucet hole cover will do the job.

Bob

J.Jackson

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2020, 11:25:11 am »
Hero : your faucet hole adaptation looks close enough to the original to make me think that’s what they started with  ;D
The 1977 version is shown on left side of the following pic , the latter 1980s? JEMCO version is on the right. That little “spout tip” is a way I can roughly spot early from latter engines. The early engines also appear to have “silver colored” connecting rods versus latter “brass colored” con-rods.
From your book and engine pic my amateur opinion is that your #8000 Thermal is looking like ~1978 Griffin type. 
{Note,PM Research still sells some parts for these engines, I may try a ‘dry fuel’ burner. https://www.pmmodelengines.com/product-category/solar/solar-accessories/ ]

Hero

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2020, 11:47:43 am »
It'll be easy enough to make the little nipple for the wick.

That PMR dry fuel burner just looks like a bottle cap!

Here's my other Solar Engines toy, a NOS Sun Motor that I found a couple of years back:



Nicer than the PMR offering, and pretty scarce, too.

Bob

J.Jackson

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2020, 12:30:23 pm »
Hero ; I have a “John Griffin” era instruction for the Sun Motor. I always wondered about the history of that style Stirling engine and when it first became available to the general public as a toy or educational demonstrator.

Swift Fox

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2020, 12:52:12 pm »
Great to read all the history behind the Solar #1 engine, makes me want to buy one!

Love that Sun Motor too!  8)
Your nose is before your eyes, so trust it first!

Hero

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2020, 01:01:20 pm »
Hero ; I have a “John Griffin” era instruction for the Sun Motor. I always wondered about the history of that style Stirling engine and when it first became available to the general public as a toy or educational demonstrator.


Yep! That's the sheet that came with my Sun Motor. But darn! the Allen key was missing! Nothing else, though.😏
Bob

Hero

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2020, 01:12:14 pm »
Jasper, will this help you date the Sun Motor?

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Bob

bigal

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #28 on: August 10, 2020, 02:58:23 pm »
It'll be easy enough to make the little nipple for the wick.

That PMR dry fuel burner just looks like a bottle cap!

Here's my other Solar Engines toy, a NOS Sun Motor that I found a couple of years back:



Nicer than the PMR offering, and pretty scarce, too.



Neat

First I've ever seen

Al

J.Jackson

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Re: Stumbled upon a vintage Solar #1
« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2020, 04:08:45 pm »
Hero :  excellent provenance on your Sun Motor !
I don’t have the Sun Motor (wish I did) but your boxes’ UPS label is very similar to my Solar #1 box. Your “Indian Tribal Series” origin UPS label clearly says your Sun Motor was shipped Jan 3 , 1979. And the address label has 11412 SM , may be a serial number (my Solar #1 is serial numbered on my label in the same spot).
Your Sun Motor is very likely late 1978 manufacture.

Swift Fox : now may be a good time to get a Solar #1. So many toy engine companies are going out of business lately it may be the twilight of the Solar era. Next year that Solar #1 may be called a Happy Ling Ling Panda Star motor from XIANJIANG