Office of Steam Forum for Model & Toy Steam Gas & Hot Air Engines
The Regular Stuff: Chat, Buy, Sell, Off Topic, etc. => General Discussion - Model & Toy Steam Engines – Stirling Cycle – Flame Lickers – Small Antique Originals => Topic started by: eec1910 on April 16, 2022, 05:49:25 am
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This morning I did a heat up test and did a video once it was fully warmed up & running... and no evidence of slowing her down.
Wow, Rich! That injection mold heater really worked out for you! And here I am fiddle-farting around with cartridge heaters... :(
If I do another vertical boiler engine that needs a heater, that's definitely the first method to try. It's strange well it worked, even with the incidental contact between the outside of the heater and inside of the boiler.
Thanks for posting the video.
Paula
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If you have ever seen the forevertron in Sauk City Wisconsin, it has a true GE(?) Generator that looks just like this seen in red in the rough picture below!
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This morning I did a heat up test and did a video once it was fully warmed up & running.
@5 minutes 110 F at base - Water sizzling
@8.5 minutes 150 F at base - Whistle working
@10 minutes 179 F at base - Running under steam
@12~15 minutes ~200 F at base - Full Steam and runs like a bat out of hell!
Shortly after this she is at full power and no evidence of slowing her down. Even engaging for a number of seconds the whistle only slows her down a bit. Once whistle is close she recovers and bounces back to full stream speed. Another thing, when I remove the power she will keep running for a number of minutes. My other B31 does this too but not to the not to the extent of this B31 with the Injected Mould Heating Element Band Heater.
The video shows my temperature gun taking some readings but take a look on how fast she goes! Poor little guy with no sight glass :(
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRm-UaMUBqI
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I wouldn't say they are flexible. I gave the burnt one a bit of a pull and it started to make a cracking noise. The method that @eec1910 came up with seems pretty good - I just don't have anything else to put into the middle other than a 1-inch socket.
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How flexible are these Chinese heaters? I am wondering if a turnbuckle type arrangement couldn’t be made to fit inside in order to expand the heater out to make full contact with the boiler.
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I got the B31 running, though I completely misread @eec1910 comment about the "i used the original two clamps with the ends flattened that press the mica to the boiler". I thought I needed mica in there (I think @komet163b said I didn't). I burnt up the first one because my 1-inch socket fell out of the center whilst I was on the phone and didn't realize it until I turned the engine over to see why it stopped making steam. I am a darn idiot.
I came back re-read the post and reviewed the photos and it hit me to also flatten out the brackets that came with the Chinese heater. Luckily these come in a "two pack" and I tried again. 1-inch socket is a bit more snug but I really need that socket in my tool case! Perhaps if I PM @eec1910 he'll make me one.
More parts to get for this B31 (whistle body, front screw, all sight fittings missing), and a bottom cover. But she is a real good runner - after I unplug her from power she seemed to run forever!
Parts used:
eBay from China: 110V 380W Injected Mould Heating Element Band Heater 35 x 35mm/1.4' x 1.4 inch (came in a 2-Pack)
McMaster-Carr: 69405K54 Noninsulated High-Temperature Ring Terminals (900° F)
McMaster-Carr: 2573K41 Expandable Electrical-Insulating Tube Sleeving (-65° to 390° F)
PS:
I have lots of the Ring Terminals and that high temp tube sleeving - happy to share for just postage. That sleeving just fits over the wire but does a darn good job on the rings, as they aren't insulated. I have regular insulated terminals but I was worried about the heat under there and the insulation melting away. So I went the route of high temp parts from McMaster-Carr.
[attachimg=1]
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Well, the sight glass fittings had brass screws soldered in when I got my first B31, which I took them out. Today I got some 1/4 stainless steel bolts to plug them up, until I could some up with donor sight glass fittings. Lucky me the top 1/4 female is stripped. I figured I couldn't make that worse, so I used a donor tank's female fitting (it had been dropped hard and the fitting I needed was already 1/3 out from the tank). I would not call it nicely done but it has been transferred and should hold pressure. Heck, I am not even going to share a photo, cause its fugly LOL
I'll have to "borrow" the side flat head screw and a whistle top from my spare B30 once the heater comes in from China. If this thing makes steam and runs, I'd call that a success! If not, I've had fun trying :-)
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Glad for Empire lovers to jump on the wagon. I
enjoy making runner out of a shelf queen.
I took one of these band heaters apart out of
curiosity. I have a Play Boy engine w/o a heater
and I may try the inner heating band there. I
must admit, someone else did it before me.
Tuckered in Brooklyn,
Wayne
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Okay, I used Advanced Search (duh) and found the post where Wayne pointed out these heaters and @eec1910 (https://www.officeofsteamforum.com/index.php?action=profile;u=329) bought off eBay - they are still for sale. The thread is: Elektro runs - homemade Teflon rings and new band boiler. (http://Elektro runs - homemade Teflon rings and new band boiler)
(https://www.ebay.com/itm/393385361943?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649) (https://www.ebay.com/itm/393385361943?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649)Part / Sale item is called: 110V 380W Injected Mould Heating (https://www.ebay.com/itm/393385361943?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649) Element Band Heater 35x35mm 2pcs
Information from the eBay Sale:
Rust resistant steel sheath, stainless steel clamp type lock-up, notched sleeve allows installation, flush with nozzle hex. It is mainly used in the heating devices of plastic injection machine stuffing container.
Power : 380W;Voltage : 110V
Band size : 35 x 35mm/1.4' x 1.4 inch (inner Dia.H);braid lead length (each) : 31cm/12.2''
Package Content : 2 x stainless steel band heater
Now that I have a photo, I can see that I only need the outer steel band (I have that) this heater from our friend Pres. Xi, then something to stick inside for heat displacement - then a cover of course. I'll be get getting another B30 in soon, so I'll be able to steal its A/C cord power pins. Cap the sight glass holes for now, with proper pipe thread bots and bob's your uncle.
@komet163b (https://www.officeofsteamforum.com/index.php?action=profile;u=74) I am kind of cursing you ATM - I been fussing about this since your post that I should hold on to this B31 LMAO! Actually, you are the best :-)
Edit: Hmm, seems there is some Mica involved too. I think I see it now but that doesn't look like the mica I took out of my B-31.... is that "fresh / new" mica? Source?
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Listing on hold for now - I am now squarely on the fence about this Engine. Seems like having a B30, B31, and a B35 would make a nice trifecta (then little poor of No 90 out there for the heck of it).
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@eec1910 So is that iron part, between the shield and brass, part of the original heater? I know on the B-31 I have is missing the bottom mounting plate & power terminals. I am trying to figure out if I should take @komet163b advise to keep it and get it running. It is a way cool engine I have to say...
Here is what I have for the bottom heater - I pulled out the "clamps" which had the mica/heater strip in the hole. I just don't know if there was suppose to be an iron core or something in there too (or it was just an open hole).
Here is are two photos after I got that heater stuff out and clean her up a wee bit.
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gee, just what I need to see - a heater replacement for a B31.... gets me thinking.
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Regarding the handles...I have two EMPIRE's w/wooden handles
and in both cases the handle narrows like yours does then has
a bit of a bulge at the bottom that yours doesn't. But, the
color is good so I'm thinking this is just a minor variation.
Wayne
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Here's a quick run down of how i replaced the heater on my B31,
take the shroud of the new heater and flatten both ends.
connect two crimp on connectors to ends of wires,
i used the original two clamps with the ends flattened that press the mica to the boiler,
assemble the shroud and clamps together like a sandwich put the heater in the middle of them,
i then turned a piece of brass to 2"x35mm with a 10mm bore and pushed it into the middle of
the heater to act as a heat sink.
Put the plate back on and enjoy.
Can anyone tell me if the two handles on the last photo are original or not ?
thanks Trevor.
[attachurl=2][attachimg=2][attachimg=3][attachimg=4][attachimg=5][attachimg=6]
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Beautiful setup and that B31 looks factory new...congrats! Also love that generator, looks like a time machine!!!
Roger
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Thanks for the comments, will post some pics of what i did later next week,
Trevor.
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Pretty engine and a nice-n-powerful runner. Looks
as good as new!
Do you have any pix of your heater installation?
I'd love to see how you did it using the Chinese
band heater. Thanks for the mention on my use
of this heater alternative. Any time I learn a
good trick to solve a problem, I'll share it while
trying not to break my arm patting myself on the back.
Telling my wife and son about this stuff is like
talking to a stone wall.
Happy Steaming,
Wayne
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Hey Trevor, that's beautiful B31, runs very nicely and has no problems
with that generator. Great combo.
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nice combination & runs well, I'm sure folks would want to know how you brought your engine back to life with a replacement heater.
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Here's my Empire B31 running again after replacing the mica heater with a chinese ebay purchase, thanks to
Wayne for the link, i used the one in the second link and as you can see it works great.
Trevor.
https://youtu.be/SHkHEco0f8I